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So I work with EBSCO industries has in Ava heard of EBSCO who was not heard of emsco yeah I figured that way so EBSCO we're based in Birmingham Alabama been working there since just. After Thanksgiving and EBSCO is actually it stands for Elton be Stephens company so it's a privately held company in Alabama it's been around 75 years now and great to be there so I've had 27 years of experience in information systems and security a loved IT Crowd. Email of IT Crowd pretty funny but it made me think about what used to be identity he just were kind of in the corner hidden away nobody really knew what identity was and now finally people are paying attention to identity in the InfoSec. World but it's really come about in last few. Last few years as I said the 75 years xcos been around they. Have a number of different companies where all over the place in terms of presence with employees that we have if you look at this you don't know any of these but Moultrie for example in the upper right that's outdoor cameras so if you ever hunt and put out the cameras it. Like motion detect and take your pictures of the deer on your property we sell that we sell real estate we sell insurance digital libraries lug soars actually stands like. Very death stands we make those so you can stand up or sit down so a number of different companies that we support so the the idea behind using octa in particularly trying to get our hands. Around locking down accounts being able to provision and deprovision as quickly as we can so the company buys and sells and we never know when they're going to do it so it's it's it's a constant cycle for us so we're really looking to move away from the traditional ad structure into an IDP with with octa to help us. And allow us to start bringing in and taking out businesses as they come and go so why why did we get doctor though really came back to our RFC so John Graham actually came from Jabil before it was pretty much a mandate and I thought it was really cool when I. Was talking to him and interviewing the the CIO has the same belief that John does that identity is critical if we can if we can get our hands around that and control the poor passwords that people have out there will really cut down on the security risks we have so. It's been a big push for us so we've been using Microsoft for ad FS for quite some time made the decision that we were going to go with off diff for provisioning as well but primarily to standardize on SSO and MFA and we've we've actually gotten through that in the first three months and. We actually rolled over office 365 about three weeks ago I think it was so that really helped us we were getting hit with spray attacks they only talk about that a little bit more later but that was a huge win for us so all the. Applications within ock they're all and if they enabled now and we're just rolling more and more of those into it and automation is the next thing so we'll start looking at ServiceNow. Office 365 and a couple other applications for automation as well as HR as our master going forward all right well good afternoon I'm glad. You all kind of packed in here and came to listen to our short spiel first I want to thank octa for allowing us to come and speak on behalf of on Octus product line it's been a fantastic journey we've been able to do quite a few things in a short amount of time and I really want to thank octave. For that and think for a lot of us we all have some of the same challenges and I think us as an IT security community it's good for us to get together and talk about these things and help understand the. Solutions that are out there. Today so a quick short bio of myself my name is al Dixon currently I'm the principal IT security architect at EBSCO been there for about seven years and a number of roles of being a 365 administrator I've also been on the identity access management team and now I'm in a new role as the principal IT security architect this. Is my passion IT security as much is my passion so it's something I enjoy talking about and if any of you all want to talk you. Know we can have a sidebar we. Can get in so just a mom some details all right so let's talk about a little bit of how did we get here why did we decide to go to octa in a sense a lot of companies are not. Quite sure of their maturity just yet when they're actually moving to the cloud this poor guy here this is actually a picture of my old boss after I tried to explain to him our enterprise licensing agreement he quit right but seriously I think a lot of companies need to really assess where they. Are at and within their maturity money and what we found is is that a lot of the cloud of doctrine happened so fast that a lot of times a lot of companies senior leaders are not making the best decisions around guardrails of what they should be doing when they make their journey to the cloud and. A lot of times it's not that easy to do because in a. Sense you actually have to understand your posture so we adopted up a DFS as a as. A single sign-on platform we understood there was a little bit less mature and we knew that we're going to we were going to need an actual edenia access management platform we had a number of things happening around our organization as far as multiple multiple single sign-on platforms. And I had you know what we saw was that the company itself was suffering from what I call digital identity schizophrenia we had people using accounts here and they would use an accounts over here and you really quite really didn't know quite where or which account. To use and so we found that we needed to centralize those services and that's where octa came in and really helped us with that journey as you know with with a TFS we had a lot of complexity around that. Architecture so just to give you an idea this is kind of what we had put together when we rolled out to office 365 as a means of architecture to ensure. That single sign-on was there we know. That we had suffered through a number of attacks password sprays DDoS attacks now here's our infrastructure way is less complex and way easier to manage so let's talk about once we got understood and our maturity level started to go up a little bit we understood. What our business requirements were we understood what our security requirements were so now we understood that ruh needed a much more mature platform such as octa we had did some searching around and we landed on octa we understood that identity. Lifecycle management for provisioning and de-provisioning accounts was key because in a. Sense we understood that the provisioning. On account actually had cost benefits to removing licenses for people who weren't utilizing no services anymore we understood the reduction in. Cost from the not having too many servers systems that our system administrators have to. Actually monitor one of the big I think pieces was a methane we have a lot of serious security related issues and we have like Willie mentioned. We have business offices all over the world so if we know that a user is typically logging. In in France and all of a sudden now they're logging in from lick skill at Alabama lick skillet is a real place in Alabama okay all right we knew that we needed to possibly take action investigate that a little bit closer so in a sense that helped us with the. Adaptive multi-factor authentication the other piece was we needed something that was scaleable in that piece for scalability came with with with octo here's some of. The other benefits of ye should. Look at moving to office 365 and we've seen that we've benefited from many of these particular items now let's get down to the meat of what you need to. Do when you get back to the office on Monday thou shall enable MFA if you're going to be moving to the cloud take that as commandment number one talk to your to your business leaders within your organization and ensure that they enable MFA take a lesson. From me we saw a lot of attacks and this would have saved. Us in many instances understood that there may be a cultural thing that you may have to go through as a for as part. Of enabling mfa but it's a big benefit and some of the other lessons learned that I saw is that as you move to the cloud you're gonna see that the dynamics of your team are going to change drastically the Danny access management. Came as a byproduct of us moving to 365 but once we got a little bit more mature and understood that that became a required service that people were going to need it then our team started to change a little bit and this is. Where we ended up we have an AFOL attending access management team we have a security team that are looking at cloud base things and we've benefit and last point communicate communicate and communicate thank you I think so ok I'm rich Kellan I am the chief information security officer for Corvo as Steve just mentioned. I was a month ago named the head of IT infrastructure I've been at. Corvo about eight months I may ask anybody ever heard of Corvo yes you know. There's a way that two guys with me so I previous my last 26 years I've been I started with HP and I've been. Running HP splits HP split in 99 to Agilent I went to Angelyn Angelyn split in 2014 I went to keysight which is part of split Corvo recruited me about eight months ago so the reason I say that is because a lot of the experience I'll. Talk about in those splits and in integrations and those kinds of things. If we get into the Q&A a lot of back and forth with Microsoft a lot of back and forth. With octave and. I started with octave back in 2014. At keysight bought a bunch of companies and added aminata and then back. In 2017 did an EA and went to Microsoft so I first thing I did when I came to Corvo was take us to off dust so if that tells you I've been on both sides of the house so we'll talk a little bit about some of that so a little bit about Corvo we. Are public in 2018 a little over three billion dollars in revenue we have about nine and employs about 15,000 clients and then of course a number. Of engineering things around the company and different stuff but we play in the RF semiconductor space love this picture here that stole this from an investor day picture because people have no idea what RF is but we're in. Pretty much everything I bet we're in everybody's pocket or on everybody's wrist or everybody's something in the audience so you may not know us but but we're in your life you we play an infrastructure so all the 5g infrastructure that's getting put in you know there's a big place for us as well as in the mobility devices and those. Kinds of things so so enough about Corbeau as a company let's talk about let's talk to mighty stuff so this is our stack and the reason I wanted to show you our IT stack a little bit is to. Show because a company like Corbeau we were a merger about four years ago of two companies that had been in the. Business for quite a while and come out of other companies that had been around a while so kohrville has. Only been around about four years but are the two companies that merged or you know 20 30 years old but our model and where the CIO has taken us I think since the mergers is pretty much a cloud first. Attitude so we are 365 we have nothing on Prem from an O 365 perspective all our email everything is in the cloud this is obviously where octave plays a big big space for us all of our sales you can guess which apps those are payroll and and about sixty other. Apps in the cloud major stuff but even on our on Prem data centers so my team's run three primary data centers and them of course we have engineering data centers around the world but about 98 percent virtualized. A hundred percent virtualized on anything we can that's our first premise bring it in its virtualized so we don't want to run a bunch of servers on Prem I think Freddie's speech this morning and you know it was really good about why do you want to run IT. Anymore you know that that piece is growing very small so it's either in the cloud or its. Virtualized we want to stay out of the server business as much as possible very heavy Microsoft environment where 99% eighty six so we run a lot of Windows server in our environment and um since I've. Been in place about eight months ago and I'll show you a slide here in a minute we put security in the cloud whenever we can so a lot of old time security people I don't know how many people in the audience are security people. Versus IT people so few people okay so. I bet some of you that have been in the business for a while said at some time we're never putting security in the cloud because I don't trust the cloud and everything and now now we all say as much as we can there because it gives us that flexibility to protect what we can everywhere else. And then we deal. With a worldwide presence offices around the world and 22 of those with IT so this is what korva looks like and we run fabs we're in the semiconductor well RF semiconductor business all of our most of our fabs are in the US. I don't think we show the one in Costa Rica up here but our largest site in the world is in China we have 2,000 people in China but we do assembly and test there so we don't run fabs there for obvious reasons because they want that technology and we. Don't want them. To take that talk of technology so we do it at these locations. Here but what I want you to understand about fabs is much like manufacturing I spent 20 years in large manufacturing companies is very high-tech products you have a lot. Of high-tech stuff in fabs and manufacturing centers but you also bring along with that you know things that were put in place 20 years ago we have you know XP boxes we probably have Windows and tea boxes in there alongside this really high-tech super expensive stuff so from a security perspective we have to protect old and new. In these critical critical facilities that you know are very sought-after technology if you understood some of those initials under there which I'm not going. To test you on later on the other spectrum of that we are extremely mobile so if you don't work in. A fab our workforce is at 55 engineering sites around the world we create IP in the South of France we create IP and you know everywhere in Asia everywhere in Europe Germany all over the United States. Cedar Rapids Iowa Boston Florida etc so so we have to deal with that mobile dispersed workforce it's really handling critical data for us and protecting that when you know if you look at again going back to our applications all being in the cloud. Whether it's office 365 the one drives the share points payroll app sales of apps HR apps it's all that critical data for us is in the cloud and if it's not in the cloud it's moving around on people's. Computers now and you know so of our clients I said we had about 15,000 clients about 75% of those are mobile that's a high percentage for those of you that aren't in the infrastructure business ok Steve wanted me to show this slide here so I've had to take off all the. Confidential words on it and everything so um the reason I show this this is my security stack okay so this is one I did for the Board. Of Directors recently and you'll notice up there it doesn't say Microsoft anywhere okay and it's kind of funny we're a mixture I already said we're an extremely Microsoft shop we have a Microsoft da and we've had them. For years we love Microsoft but to be frank I want Microsoft to play in their space how many security people that have worked on EA's and things or if you talked about Microsoft ATP or you've talked about as your ad or you've talked about all those things how many people have. Been in conversations where you've heard well we think it's good enough anybody ever heard that yeah there's one right there okay there's there's the honest person I think there's a couple that we can't see past the first three people the first three rows but in the security. Business you should never be saying it's good enough because some CIO wants you to contract it because it's an easier contract or Microsoft is negotiated and hey we'll give you Windows really cheap we'll give you this really cheap but we want you on the EMM stack or whatever and we can talk about some of that bundling and unbundling a. Little bit but what we did by not putting our security stack into Microsoft and we just renegotiated our. EA eight months ago when I came in they asked me to help him with that negotiation and the first one we pulled out who's once we need an MFA I came in a company that didn't have MFA I liked her speech and I paid first that needs to be first we bought off on that so akka was the first. One in the stack we pulled out and then we went to a crowd strike because we needed an ATP and Microsoft was saying oh no we can't sell client ATP by itself now they can because they're seeing people start to go the other directions and those kinds. Of things then just recently we put in place proof point you know - instead of ATP in the class so what you see is it gives you the ability if you break that to go with Best of Breed technologies things that actually work for your environments and we're able to go back and look at what it is we're supporting. And so this isn't an anti Microsoft speech by the way I don't want to come across at all because we're full blown I'm I. Spoke at ignite two years ago on Microsoft oh three sixty five deployments I'm fully a Microsoft supporter. But when I'm talking about security and as the seaso versus my mind rollin is the infrastructure ahead I've got to pay attention to what's the best for the environment and so much we get into. Those decisions again because of the contracts more more than anything else and trust me my. Board asked me those questions and my CIO is like are you sure and I'm like if you want to make the decision. On what we buy fine you go ahead but then you're in charge of security so he didn't want to do that all right and this is why we bought octa so we we wanted to make sure that that security stack we had whether it's in the cloud whether it's on Prem that we knew who you were when you're. Accessing it multi-factor the first thing you know we all get fished every day Corvo we. Have very high highly sought-after technology it's it's if you knew what we did you'd know why but the first thing we were seeing and we were seeing it regularly when we didn't have MFA the first thing hackers. Do now is if they get somebody to click on the fish and in ten seconds they just go straight to the o365 site put in your email they've got your password they take download everything you've got so it doesn't matter if your security teams and everything change your passwords and everything. Thirty minutes they've already your entire email box right so the first the reason for that MFA first and we. Wanted to go after octave first was to at least. Kill that if we could stop him from that ability to download and do all of that you know heavy lifting then at least then. We can go focus on you know the fishing stuff with proof point the client stuff with CrowdStrike etcetera so anyway and that's me Corbeau all around you that's our singing so. You got it thanks so much rich so what I wanted to do now is just I obviously want to dig into the unbundling piece but I wanted to give Willy and out a quick. Chance you know we talked about MF a pretty heavily here was there anything in your journey that. Ought to help with that how did. You feel that that was a beneficial piece or talk a little bit more about that part of it okay yeah I can start yeah I think octaves been very helpful along the way I mean they've got a good roadmap whenever you're rolling out their software in terms of customer success project management. Team the information they give you for education for your end-users it's all about communication in the end and that's that's probably been the most difficult process octa was easy enabling MFA it's a piece of cake it's the communication going out to tell people when it's going to happen and. What it means to you and what you've got to do to get to that point so but yeah octave was great along the way we chose to go with VPN first we were using if Microsoft for VPN but we figured if we hit those users first those are. The most technical users we'll see what kind of issues we'll run in to get those registered and that would set the stage for everything else and them can work our way out from there and it. Worked well but it was you know what you'll find out whenever you're doing something and you're telling an organization that. You're gonna make a change nobody reads the same thing so you can send out an email you can put out Yammer you can put out SharePoint you could you know fly playing over there building and you know somebody might see it but it the other day there would be people who think you did a great job with communication if. You do it enough and then there'll always be somebody that complaints that's great anything out there yeah I can add a little bit more to that yeah just like Willy said that the communication is key and especially as you're rolling out these large. Projects you have to get out there in front of the customer because we as IT security people would kind of sometimes forget about the customer experience but we also have a. Job to do as well we're there to help protect them I know for our department information security specifically we had three. Products that we were actually using for a MFA that was sprawled around the actual company and we managed it within. Our department so there was an opportunity there of course to to collapse those those systems and that happened fairly quickly and we moved it actually to talkto and they were helped they were able to come in and actually help us advise us exactly what to do we target. Areas such as VPN right after that 365 to you know close off those gaps where we saw those phishing threats that were happening from you know from those malicious guys out there so it was a big benefit MFA is key and if you. Haven't started selling start selling it to your senior leadership do it Monday morning tell them I know it's cultural but we have to turn on MFA fantastic thank you very much really so rich you touched on something that is very close to. Me but I'd like you to dig into that a little bit deeper I think like actually how many people in the audience here are aware that you can actually start to dismantle or unbundle you're a how many people in the audience have EAS yeah and how many of those folks are either on or considering an e5 or being. Told they should consider any five that's that's a playbook right so yeah so again I think I just want to say real quickly I totally agree with rich I think octa we see ourselves as being strong on the identity and security side that's what we're very good at we feel. That Microsoft is a strong partner for all of you right they're a fantastic product from a Productivity perspective where we think that. Is a difference as some of the things that these gentlemen have have explained today and I actually I'd like to go into that unbundling peace and kind of walk through what what are the what are the signals or what are the things that you. Would look for or tell a a customer interested in doing the same thing to look for in their usage of say technology before they might consider an unbundling what are the key ingredients to kind. Of starting that. Process good it's probably not hypothetical because I know my octagon has had me come in and help a few of his accounts so figuring out some of this a little bit so so so first of all hopefully everybody knows you. Know Microsoft like a lot of other companies you've always you've always got to leave them you know for your next negotiation because an EA is going. To end you know three years or whatever you sign and if you don't have something to grow into that's you hit the point where costs start to jack. Up right that's that's what they get to so you've always got to have something in your head that you you want to give them but in their mind they have to grow because that's that's the mandate but going into an. E a renegotiation or you know when you do your annual true ups and those kinds of things you know a lot of companies and my previous companies we just said yeah you know we'll take everything just give it to us it's easier to count that way we didn't even we didn't even profile our users so in my current. Company because we have large. Fab manufacturing organization you know we've done Ewan's and E threes we don't do 'if I've obviously because I just showed you why so if you profile your customers. To say why am I paying for e3 is even for you know three thousand these people when all they do is go through you know email in the cloud they don't access anything they don't do share points they don't do you know any other stuff so if. You have like a mix of using knowledge and uh knowledge workers would you say that would be a situation absolutely that is our. Situation and a lot of companies have that situation but Microsoft doesn't always go to them and say hey you should profile your users first stuff now if they're working on their first sale and they're coming into it and they. Really want to get it they'll say hey you can profile because that way you don't have to pay as much for all these guys but the problem is when you get into things like as your ad and these kinds of things whether you're on e 1 or. E 5 everything they do is still done by. Headcount or depending on the license so everything you have to do whether they access app or 50 apps you're still paying you're still paying for them to do that okay and that's that's these you know there's others beyond identity but this is where people get confused in. The Microsoft contracting it's it's designed to everything to be you know cost the same right so if you look at if you buy o365 and they say oh you can put it on five clients right four for. Free right is that still the number of Microsoft users isn't it as you get at five five devices well if you have large. R&D labs I have some guys that have 30 computers in their names well that means I have to buy them in five different oh three sixty five licenses because some of that is client based and if they have different things on them now maybe I only needed one identity because it's still the same. Person logging in so you you really need to understand your profile and what you're using what you're not using because that gives you the power to go into a Microsoft contract negotiation and talk because again they'll show you they'll show you the slide that says bundle it all in because and actually they just they show. It with the three products I use they'll say if. You went with CrowdStrike Proofpoint and opted it would cost you a million and a half dollars to you know just do these products. And and I will tell you I went with CrowdStrike Proofpoint an octa and it I can't I'm not allowed to talk about pricing and stuff but it cost me less than if I'd. Had gone just with Microsoft for those products equivalent products and then I would have been just back to the but they're good enough right and we did bake-offs. By the way we did bake-offs on. The client stuff we did bake-offs on the identity stuff we did bake-offs on the even on the proof point stuff Microsoft never won not a single time my hackers were able to get through on certain things so again they want to be a security company but that's not where that's not where. They come from until they say that's what we're gonna do full time like Optus said where this is what we do we do identities and we're kind of doing identities. That we if Microsoft put the money of their company and said we only want to do that great and let's do that but they can't take away from those things that are their bread and butter so and is this a journey. That a customer has to do themselves or is this something where there could be. Helping partners other resellers or your ISPs it is their way they can help you you know having people that have done negotiations with them before is always helpful the value-added resellers that Microsoft contractors you can only you know use certain ones the ones that are. About you know they're not they'll help you with counts and things but they're they're not designed to say hey you know but you should look over here for this unless they're the reseller you're going to use for that one over there or there they're working on a better deal but. You typically you get into that the the VAR isn't going to help you as much with it um for anybody that's a Gardner customer Gardner is extremely helpful in this. Space they've got some really good experts that know you know what Microsoft is being compensated on today what you know what they've seen in other contracts and negotiations from a. Product perspective and stuff so if you're not a gardener and you're working on an EA and you're wanting to unbundle it they can help you with strategy. I think probably the best or find your rock the rep and they can find somebody that helped them. Do it not me we're working on let's see I I guess the and you kind of hinted at it earlier on but I just want one more question for you rich from the perspective of when you face the CIO or CEO or CFO for that matter who is kind of pressuring you to and you comment but I just. Wanted those are I think these. Are conversations that. A lot of our customers are having they're being told that we have this or potential to have this upgrade to the e5 or what have you or have any M&S on there um what do you say to them as a CSC. So yeah so as a C so it's pretty easy I go after the security aspect so for me you know saying look this is not the best product this is this is this is the best product if you if. You're a gardener guy and all CIOs tend to be Gartner. People you know or even CFO it's like it's easy to say what the thing my right there had been in the top right. Since day one you know Microsoft got close to them for a couple years and now they but I think even dropped down a little bit you got Centrify up there with a little bit but you know so you can use things like that but as as the sea. So it's easy for me to tell until the CFO and CIO you know the board you know hey we're going after this this is why get them all excited you know of course there's always going to come back and see a cost and that's always got to be a line-item I show them but you know in. The end the board is being held to cyber risk now as much as they are to any other financial risk and if you if you sell it as this this and you're that guy you're the head of security again no CIO should override. AC so when they're passionate no that's fair enough so stand by your and buy your gun yeah I mean it's just yeah there's a guy in in our region that my sales rep had me talking and he had been talking to octave for like two and a half years and it wasn't because he didn't want. Octa it was because he was trying to convince his company that he could get out of Microsoft and this stuff so he's finally now an optic customer now so and but the work for him was convincing. The CIO in the company that it made sense to so in I before we go to Q&A I wanted to ask Willie and now really quickly I mean it's kind of crazy when you show that slide with the hundreds and hundreds of different companies that you guys own like we talked about a doctor the M&A agility story and being. Able to do that and enable you to is there is there anything in terms of a story there in terms of how we've been able to help you to to pull in an organization or or facilitate that a little bit better I don't have anything immediate because we've had three acquisitions. Since I've been there but they've been relatively small and we incorporated them into whole in that process I gave a pretty straightforward I do think that it's. It makes sense. What that's with what we're doing and what octa is doing there was a presentation yesterday showing how to build out instead of having to collapse domains to build those out and just that that seems like the natural progression for us so going back to your earlier question sure. Microsoft can offer a lot of different things to you but how many times does Microsoft give you something and it's not a hundred percent and there's like a bolt on top of it to fix it you know. There's always so even if you had an 85. How quickly can your team picked that information up and do something with it we took octo we had no experience with octo. Hips go starting in November of last year and we have six people that can can go in and administer octave today with adding you know adding a company adding users setting up whatever we need to SSO our MFA in there it. Is very intuitive and you know Microsoft could I mean if Microsoft would have hadn't that capability with a DFS and octa may not exist now but they didn't do it so that's you know somebody said hey. I can do this better and that's why we bought the product so it's it is a cost thing at the end of the day you have a budget and you only have so much that you can spend. And if you're gonna go buy E 5 licenses and you're not gonna buy any other products at least for us so we're we're still in an I'd say an early infancy of an information system security program at EBSCO well that's what we were hired to come in and help. Build out and just the cost of what we have to. Spend to get us where we need. To be is going to be a lot of money so we have. To be very selective and what is a priority for us and what's not and I mean I we have not made the formal decision that we're not. Going with the Microsoft ephod but you know it's interesting as we go through those you get to tools like we've seen on the screen just min ago with CrowdStrike carbon black octa those are em and those tools that a lot of people use and get a lot of value. Out of it so but its ease of use I mean I I'm telling you I'm thrilled to death how quickly my team picked up octa and so proud of how they picked it up that's great oh they anything dad yeah I can. Add a little bit to that as well. Epical is a very interesting company because we have so many different lines of businesses and they all do something different so you can imagine from the security side. Of things governance is a challenge and there's always a use case for something with Akhter however you know with us having those. Mergers acquisitions and divestitures those activities a really fast pace especially for us and so when they come to us and say hey we bought a new company or we wanted a corn yeah our corn. The phrase they're called mad activities right mergers acquisitions divestitures because they moved so fast and so they want us to be able to spin on the dime they say okay we got this new company we do bring them in get them onto our email system. Bring in their directory services well before we didn't really have an avenue for that before and so as probably some of the people have already seen some of the capabilities about in order to incorporate those new. Directories incorporate those new email systems into its Universal directory so that's been a there's been a huge benefit for us I'm going back to the earlier question you know I think one of the things that companies have to do especially as you you're sitting around talking with your Microsoft rep is understand where your gaps are and doing just. A basic SWOT analysis of your company to understand that the things that they may be pitching to you you may not necessarily. Need right now and a lot of times you know finances aren't you know finite so we don't have a whole lot of money to just. Spend on these bales these whistles we may have specific things that we're trying to address you know phishing MFA those type. Of things we need to address right now we don't need to be caught in the lingo of here's an. E5 but you need a p2 for the Azure piece and here's another boat on your technology people your senior leadership your security people have to be knowledgeable of what exactly is needed and that can come from a standard risk assessment from the organization if you have a kind of a governance structure there so you. Can identify what those needs are because the salesman is gonna try to sell you and he's gonna offer everything but maybe you didn't need to leather seats dine alabamy anyway but maybe you didn't need. That particular piece but it's understanding exactly what you need when you're going into those discussions that's great thank. You out so we just have a few more minutes I'm just. Gonna leave this up there really quickly before we jump into Q&A if you are interested in having a bit more about what it looks like to do that true down we are offering workshops. And we're if you want to sign up go to this. Link this bitly link it'll just be a simple one you get send your email in we will respond to. You and schedule you up but if you're interested in that and at this point I'd like to go ahead and open up to Q&A to anybody in the audience so what do you think the smallest company size. Is that you'd be able to start doing these sorts of unbundling activities we're currently Microsoft e3 you speak up a little bit sorry we're currently on Microsoft e3 but we're only a 400 person company are we going to be able to unbundle it that sort of scale do you think. A little bit I actually just did some consulting from one of our board members nonprofits he does and it was a smaller company than ours so. I the way I understand the question is does it make sense for you to try to unbundle because of the size of your company right you know it depends so you you're probably you know better off doing as many things with Microsoft as you can. Because you can go up for much cheaper now does he five makes sense for you. Does it you know you're you're you're not at a true huge you know because Microsoft's discounts get smaller. As you get smaller right so larger companies we. Get bigger discounts it's kind of. Weirdly unfair right but and and you also lose a certain amount of negotiating power with some of those other companies your ability to get their pricing way down is harder some kind of X. A very large bank and I've discovered that the same techniques seem to work with the. Security vendors regardless of you do they say okay good yeah so that's I'm glad you said it out. Loud so I was what I was going to say is there's some and where I was. Going to tell you is um you're going to. Be better off in some of those cases going direct yourself and trying to find a vard take. A cut and do all of that and you know but you go ahead you're direct without the direct with seek saw Derek with CrowdStrike yeah yeah so yeah so it's. A balance but can and you know but again four hundred people but it goes back to. What are you doing are you growing are you are you in a growing phase you're in an acquisition phase you know because if you're if you know you're going to acquire and things your Microsoft bills just all across the board gonna go up and up and up and up much faster you know then say I. Bought octa you know I bought 400 licenses but if you know you're gonna acquire maybe you. Want to negotiate 500. Licenses these are the things I've done knowing where we're going in sometimes CI a go go go but you just bought a thousand extra licenses I'm like yeah. And I also know there's three acquisitions we're working on or whatever and it was easier for me to negotiate the pricing across the board and then they're like oh okay right so some of those. Tricks and it sounds like you know them which is good an objection or a concern that I've heard from customers is when you unbundle the cost of the items you're going to be keeping. We're gonna going to go up and cost right because. It's not just take this out and leave everything else flat how have you what's your perspective on that concern so back to my original comment was you need to know what you want to do with Microsoft right because you've got to offer them. Something typically to keep your at that renegotiating phase because that you will lose your discount ability so what he's saying is if I don't if I if I'm bundle and I think then they're gonna Jack my prices up on the things I have first of all when you work. With any company hopefully you know when you sign a three-year deal you put. A clause in that says maximize my increase on the next three-year deal but if you don't do that you should have your procurement people look at those kinds of things okay because that protects you because anybody naturally is going. To try to jump now Microsoft in general their pricing has actually come down on certain products over the years right but it's because they still have to grow they're selling additional things so if all you need is office well first of all sales reps don't get confidence office anymore people think well we offices. That's the most if you know what Microsoft reps get compensated on and it's very public Gartner will tell you because every year they change it like anybody else you play though you you go into it into an educated negotiation I well you know but I really want something more valuable to me Windows so give me a. Windows contracts because I. Don't want to do my windows buy clients anymore I want to do them by users they've got so many different pieces you can put in there that you don't need to focus on you know the identities and the the client things unless you want them but there are some. Things you might want right so again they have some really good products know what you want but take that assessment before you go into the negotiation don't don't start the negotiation and then start to figure out what you which. What you want and what you need.


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